Setting up truck for dump trailer?

Discussion in 'Tanker, Bulk and Dump Trucking Forum' started by tnpete, Apr 28, 2018.

  1. tnpete

    tnpete Medium Load Member

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    May be setting up a truck for a dump trailer. Would be local hauls. Under the 100 mile radius. 99% of it hauling sand. Thinking short dump trailer, where its easy to get into and out of tight spots. So if I go with a 24ft 1/4th frame or frameless.
    What would be the best wheelbase on the truck?
    What would be the minimum distance between BOC or Sleeper and 5th wheel kingpin?
    I have a 1995 T600 now. It has a sleeper on it. Thus the reason of throwing in the back of sleeper above.
    Truck has 624,000 miles on it. 11.1 Detroit,10 Speed Direct trans, single axle 2.93 rearend. That would be swapped out for a set of tandems. And better gears for pulling 80,000 to 88,000 lb gross.

    Engine has been swapped from a DDEC-3 to DDEC-4. HP is 400 HP @ 1350 Torque. I know for most that is not enough HP. But hauled Hot Mix and rock for years. Using Tri-Axles dumps, and high HP was 350 HP with a cummins L10 and 855 cummins.

    May buy a different truck. But hard to think of doing. As this one is sitting here, paid for in good shape. Pull the bed off it. Take out the single axle rearend. Put a tandem under it, with added frame rails. So as you can see, I can make the wheelbase what works best for this type or work. Not make something work that may not work good.

    Truck would be running 6 or 7 days per week. Looking like it may well have to have 2 drivers. Used to be I would work both shifts myself. But with the limits today, don't see how I could get away with running it 16 hrs per day.

    If you have any thoughts on what will work. Or what will not work. Please add them, I have never pulled a dump trailer. Dumped Thousands of loads out of a Tri-Alxe. Ran a few million miles OTR and local. But this is going to be new.
    Pete
     
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  3. Pedigreed Bulldog

    Pedigreed Bulldog Road Train Member

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    For the money it would cost to make the necessary alterations it would take to get your truck ready for the type of work you're going to be doing, you could just go buy a truck already spec'd for the job. You're already talking about swapping a single axle for a twin screw set up. The direct drive transmission won't get you decent road speeds with rear gears low enough to handle off-road site work...so plan on swapping that, too. 400/1350 under the hood may have seemed like a lot 50 years ago, but by today's standards you won't be able to get out of your own way.

    ...and a 24' trailer won't be legal on the bridge law with anywhere near 80K without adding a few extra axles. 38' is about the minimum in order to fall under the exception that allows 34 & 34 on the drives and trailer tandems to get 80 on 5. If the truck's wheelbase is too short, it might further reduce what you can haul.

    ...and a truck that old with those specs likely won't hold up running 2 shifts per day 7 days per week. YOU might be able to nurse it along, but your hired hand probably won't. He's paid by the ton, so his goal is to load as much as he can and get it where it needs to go as fast as he can to go load some more. That's how he makes his money. You make your money the same way, but unlike him you have incentive NOT to abuse the truck because it costs you money. He might miss a day or two of work when the truck is down. You miss work AND have to pay for the repairs.
     
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  4. Sumtinlidat

    Sumtinlidat Light Load Member

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    Most end dump trucks are min 210” WB. I’ve seen lower but as stated. Overall lengths come to play when hauling tonage. I’m not trying to dismay you from going into dumps. But it’s best to start with the right equipment rather tinker with something that’ll cost more in the long run. For a one/two man operation I always say go with a quad axle dump truck. Very versatile. Usually legal for 17.5-18 tons legal. Many decent ones on truckpaper. It can be used to haul aggregate and work with asphalt companies
     
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  5. RET423

    RET423 Medium Load Member

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    A wet kit will cost you about $3000 dollars if you install it yourself, buying a cutoff with a complete rear suspension, housings and wheels will be at least $8000 if they are inspected and bought from a reputable seller; then you have the expense if having the frame work done and driveshafts built.

    I think the cost will exceed the trucks value very quickly especially if you are going to hire a shop to do all the work. But if you want to do it this way I would shoot for 140 inches from cab rear to the center of rear-ends, this will enable you to capitalize on the bridge laws in most States if you buy a long enough trailer.

    The trailer you are thinking of is way too short to haul on a tonnage rate, your engine is plenty to work locally and a direct drive transmission will be fine if buy 3:55 ratio rear-ends (which are very common).

    A 1995 400 hp engine is a true 400 hp, modern engines are rated BEFORE the emissions aftertreatment system is installed; a 1995 400 will almost run with a 2018 500 hp engine on the road. Are you sure you only have 1350 torque? If so I would be making a few mods to get that up a bit.

    I do these kinds of change overs all the time but I have the facilities and skills to do all the work myself (just parts expense), I would never try this much modification if I had to pay someone to do it; unless I just really loved the truck and wanted to keep driving it no matter what.
     
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  6. tnpete

    tnpete Medium Load Member

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    Thanks guys I always hauled 24 to 26 tons here in a Tri-Axle. But was not allowed on the Interstates. Quad Axles are not able to meet the Bridge law in Tn also. And being its 74,000 lbs for a Tri, 80,000 lbs with a Quad axle. Not worth it for the extra axle. Most around us run a 22 to 26ft Dump Trailer. There also limited to 80,000 lbs.
    Only reason of thinking about a dump trailer over a Tri-Axle. Is I can pull a flatbed or grain with it. Where the Triaxle dumptruck limits you on so many things. When I was running a 1987 9370 Eagle with 16ft Rogers bed. Triaxle and one fuel tank. That truck could haul 24 tons of hot mix. Or 24.5 tons of sand or rock. The GMC Brigadier I ran was the money maker. That truck I hauled 26 tons of mix. Or 26.2 tons of other stuff It had a 13 speed and 16ft dump bed Triaxle with L10 cummins.
    Reason for thinking about swapping out the rears on the Kenworth. I have a set of 3:55's I can get cheap. Local guy would swap them out for $1500. including extending the rails. Cutoff has everything I would need. Even 5ft of frame rails in front of it.
    As for the 1350 Torque. I think it can be bumped up to 1450. But that is about all for it. It was ordered to pull doubles. So the reason of direct and 2.93's. But I used to run a Freightliner same engine. in the 90's. Even out west it done good. But it had 3:55's and a Direct 10 speed.
    I keep thinking go with a Triaxle. One less axle to keep up. Most can't haul much more if any with the dump trailer. But was just thinking the Kenworth is paid for . But more work Less cash.
    Found out this evening, there only going to run 12 hours. Not going to do the 2 shifts. So I can run it all myself. That would make life better on any truck. As a driver will not take care of it like I would.
    This will be around 2 years of work. Then for me its over anyway. As that is all I'm going to work. Then its retirement and drive for fun.
    Thanks for the reply's. As everyone knows always opens a persons eyes. When you get feedback from others.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2018
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