Need Help Understanding O/O Pay (LONG)

Discussion in 'Ask An Owner Operator' started by lawdog57, Jan 25, 2008.

  1. lawdog57

    lawdog57 Bobtail Member

    3
    0
    Jan 24, 2008
    southern illinois
    0
    First let me immediately express my deepest respect and admiration for all drivers. For the past five years I owned a local trucking company running dumps and semi dumps with frameless trailers and side dump trailers. Health reasons and the economy helped make the decision to shut it down and we helped our drivers obtain jobs with similar pay at other companies because they were really like family to us. I have only the deepest respect for anyone who can deal with the stress and fight constantly to make a living in such a hard way.

    I came to this forum to ask for help with a problem. My ex-husband is an Owner Operator who is out two weeks, in for a weekend then back out for two weeks again. He pulls a Reefer? He has worked for Great American, Dart, Thomason Transportation and a few others. I have gone out of my way to make sure that he gets to have the kids for visitation everytime he manages to come in and let the older boy go out on the road for a couple of weeks at a time in the summer. We've tried our best to work together to parent the kids and everything is fine except in one area and that is in the child support and medical insurance. He has said that every company he works for does not offer family medical plans and I think they do. He refuses to pay the child support and has lied to me for years about how hard of a time he was having out there making money. I believed it and let it go, not griping when he didn't pay or only pay half or less each month. (650.00 for 3 kids) I recently find out that he has bought himself a big fancy pick up truck with a payment book of $800.00 per month. Now, with him being out on the road and home 2 weekends of each month he is paying $800.00 a month for a vehicle he drives for four days each month. Yet he can't pay his child support? :biggrin_2557: It gets deeper and worse than all this and to keep it short, he managed to buy himself a fancy house, a fancy car to go with his expensive truck and do all of this by refusing to take care of his kids and didn't pay the child support each month so he could take care of himself first. I'm not out for revenge on him, I just need to understand how his pay works so we can get what is owed to his children. Nothing more or less. :biggrin_25520: Of course, revenge would make me feel better but that isn't setting a good example for the kids so I'll just settle for being fair. :biggrin_25523:

    As an O/O the law is unclear about whether he is an employee of a company he is leased to or just an o/o. We can't get a child support withholding notice served on his employer if we can't learn what is correct about it. Could someone please advise?

    Further, could someone give me an idea of what net income would possibly be each week and how per diems, reimbursements, etc...are all paid. I am very confused about all of this as we never dealt with anything like this in our small trucking company.

    I would really appreciate any advise on this. I only want what he should have paid to care for his kids. Any help will get us one step closer to that goal. Thank you in advance. :biggrin_25517:
     
  2. Truckers Report Jobs

    Trucking Jobs in 30 seconds

    Every month 400 people find a job with the help of TruckersReport.

  3. Designors

    Designors Light Load Member

    149
    7
    Sep 23, 2007
    NM
    0
    To start .... as an O/O .... he is his own company .... he is just contracted with others to run their freight .... legally that company is NOT required to withhold from his settlements for the support since he is not an employee

    As for insurance .... when you are a O/O .... the majority of companies do not offer insurance .... some do .... he would have to get it on his own thu an insurance company

    As for the net income and money he makes .... it depends on every company as to what he gets paid .... and to be brutally honest about it .... there are a million ways that he can hide what he actually makes and to show that he is loosing money

    As for the support .... they would have to serve him since he is his own boss .... the company that he is working for wont withhold and would just turn it over to him

    It would be costly unless the state is willing to step in on it .... to get him to produce his statements .... the only option is to see what the state that you reside in says about it all and what they can do for you

     
  4. lawdog57

    lawdog57 Bobtail Member

    3
    0
    Jan 24, 2008
    southern illinois
    0
    Thank you for a fast reply. I was afraid that was what I was going to find out. I was hoping to avoid paying out so much money for an attorney and an accountant to go thru his books. If I go thru the state they will suspend his drivers license which won't do either of us any good if he can't work or even worse, if he gets put in jail. :biggrin_2553: He really owes me a lot of money. :biggrin_2555: Again, thank you for the fast reply and honest information. I appreciate it and hope you all stay safe out there.
     
  5. Daycabber

    Daycabber Light Load Member

    50
    19
    Jan 24, 2008
    China Grove, NC
    0
    It sound like you need to take him to court over the child support issue. He would have no choice but to prove his income to a judge. He owns his own business and if he is filing taxes as he should then the court can "easily" find out his income. A private investigator or lawyer may even easily find that out through tax records.

    As far as how much an O/O makes? A lot of factors determine his income or if he has an income at all. Based on the fact there is an $800 payment for a new truck, he does have some decent income. If he is leased on with a good company and smart with every angle of his business, he may or may not be making $100,000 a year running hard all the time. If he has a huge tractor/trailer payment and it burn excess fuel then top that with poor money management he could be making half of that or much less. I realize that probably just confused the situation more, but 2 drivers with different type trucks and circumstances leased to the same company could be making totally different incomes after expenses.

    In "my opinion" you really need to take him to court over it, based on the info you gave. It doesn't sound like he intends for you to know his true income. The judge will set an amount he must pay every month. You "will win" this case for sure. I am an owner operator with my own authority. (I don't lease to anyone, I am the company) I generally work 3 or 4 days a week. Without a truck payment and after expenses, I make around $65,000 per year but I am home almost every night not running more than 300 miles from home. I have a wife 3 children and one on the way and my time with them is very important.

    Please talk to a lawyer.
     
  6. Designors

    Designors Light Load Member

    149
    7
    Sep 23, 2007
    NM
    0
    The only thing with the taxes .... like I said .... there are millions of ways to hide money .... and depending on the accountant he has they are good at it also

    He could take in all his records to court and they would have to go thru it all with a fine tooth comb before they found anything .... and if it was done good it would be hard still

    The reason I say this is because I can take someones income and make them look like they should own a mansion or that they should be living in a card board box

    The IRS does have a lot of loop holes in it that allows for this legally .... its just a matter of knowing them .... if you get the right accountant and tell them that you want it to show loss ... they can do that

    As for the courts .... they wouldnt suspend his license right away and probably not for awhile .... they know that he needs it to work and taking it away wouldnt help anyone .... they would do other things to him

    As for jail .... doubt it .... especially in IL .... IL is not known to be a real hard ##### on things .... best option talk to child support .... tell them what is going on and see what they can do

    That would be the first step .... they wont charge you to get the money as an attorney (blood suckers) would .... make an appointment to talk with your case worker there and see what options they give you
     
  7. TX_Proud

    TX_Proud Light Load Member

    208
    54
    Jan 2, 2007
    Houston, TX
    0
    Contact your state's Attorney General. You should not have to hire an attorney; if the courts have ordered support and he is not paying, the AG will help you work through collecting.

    I was not clear on whether your ex is an O/O or not. If he owns his own rig and is leased to a carrier or has his own operating authority, then he would be considered an O/O. However, if he is driving a truck for someone else who is an O/O, then he clearly is an employee. If this is the case, then that O/O is responsible for withholding child support once they receive the order from the AG.

    If you don't get satisfaction there, call the IRS. They can hold any refunds he may have coming.
     
  8. Big Duker

    Big Duker "Don Cheto"

    2,921
    2,867
    Sep 18, 2007
    Weatherford, TX
    0
    He must have good credit to get a loan for an $800. month pickup. A lot of O O do hide money. I know one who was making over 65,000 a year and on the books it looked like he was making less than $30K. But when he went to refinance house or get new vehicle was turned down for anything but a compact car under $20k. A lot of judges will tell him to pay up or they will hold him in contempt. Good luck to you.
     
  9. Truckerjo

    Truckerjo Road Train Member

    2,314
    341
    Sep 5, 2006
    Indiana
    0
    I really dislike people like this... I know it is hard to make it out there nowadays but he should help out with the kids.. Even if it is not the full $650 he should still help out...

    Just my 2 cents...

    I have 2 kids, one I have full custody of and the other lives with her mom..(2 kids by 2 different women:biggrin_25517:) I receive no child support from the one mother but I still help out for my other child... I do make sure it is spent on her though and not spent on improving the mothers lifestyle.. (things like making sure she gets new cloths, shoes ext...)

    Some good advise above and good luck....
     
  10. im6under

    im6under Heavy Load Member

    782
    406
    Feb 13, 2007
    iowa
    0
    when he got his truck, car and house he had to provide proof of income to the bank.

    my understanding is you can ask the judge to order the bank to turn over his application for credit.

    and the judge can consider this in determining child support. Also the judge can force him to sell or liquidate assets that are keeping him from paying child support.

    meaning I can't pay your honor because I have a 800 dollar a month truck payment. then the judge can say, ok, you got thirty days to get that sold and start paying the money to your children or go to jail.

    you need to stay after this and make it happen. squeaky wheel gets the grease.
     
  11. lawdog57

    lawdog57 Bobtail Member

    3
    0
    Jan 24, 2008
    southern illinois
    0
    Thanks to each and every one of you for your answers and tips. It really helped to make sense out of some of the things I questioned. As far as I know, he makes payments on his older model semi truck then leases to different companies? I don't think he has his own operating authority. It's really a big mess. I have an attorney and when I go after him he gets scared and will agree to things outside of court then my attorney goes to the judge with it to have it awarded and filed. I went thru the state of Illinois division of child support and because he pays the support once in awhile they pretty much told me to be grateful that I'm getting anything at all as they have bigger fish to fry. :biggrin_25510: As of right now he owes me seven thousand dollars for just the past few years. They intercept his taxes but it amounts to very little. Because he claims to be self employed the state can't enforce the child support order which gives him the freedom to pay as he wants to.

    Truckerjoe, you are a good father and a good person. Just remember something. The child support is for the parent to use as needed. You pay for the house, electricity, water, cable, internet, activities, doctors, dentists, toys, etc. The Child Support basically pays you back for what you are paying out. :biggrin_25520: My ex told my kids that the money is supposed to go to them to spend how they wanted and that I spend the money on myself instead. Funny isn't it? My new husband, who is a cop, has the kids on his government insurance plan at his expense of three hundred every month. We have no dental insurance and three mouths full of braces to pay for. :biggrin_25521: One kid has to have prescription medication for allergies every month that we couldn't afford without the insurance. Gymnastics, football, basketball, track, etc. Normal kids doing normal activities but that six fifty per month doesn't even begin to cover the monthly costs. Actually, I settled for six fifty but the attorney said his income put the child support at nine hundred something....I was trying to be nice. Over the past few years one has had several accidents requiring stitches. Another flipped the four wheeler and broke both his arms at the same time. The girl hasn't broke anything yet. :biggrin_2554: I guess my point is that when you first hear that amount, six fifty per month, it sounds like a lot of money but when you break it down and think about everything you pay out because you want your kids to be well cared for and have a good home and good childhood...well, that sixfifty for three kids doesn't help pay for much. Then, when he calls me and actually has the nerve to tell me he hasnt been able to pay the support because he had to pay his Dodge truck payment of $800.00 per month I decided that enough was enough. Especially considering that since we shut our construction company down and I am no longer able to work I sold my 2004 Ford vehicle with a $450.00 per month payment at a loss, went to an auction and bought a 1997 used van for cash because the financial needs of my kids come first. Two growing teen boys and a pre teen girl eat a lot of food! :biggrin_2556: That $450.00 per month pays for the groceries each month instead of a truck. Lucky for my children and I my new husband loves them like his own and provides for them by working full time as a police detective and part time at two other jobs. When that child support that we count on isn't there each month we have a harder time paying the bills. I hope this makes some sense to everyone. :biggrin_25515:

    Well, that is my sob story and I wish I could say I was exaggerating about my ex husband and his childish ways but unfortunately it is all true and much much more. I respect that he works hard as a truck driver but coming in every other weekend, going out to eat and to the movies and buying them toys is good parenting but BAD PROVIDING! :biggrin_25510:
     
  • Truckers Report Jobs

    Trucking Jobs in 30 seconds

    Every month 400 people find a job with the help of TruckersReport.