On Monday afternoon I was driving on I-75 in my car when I noticed, as I was passing, that a new 589 Pete had a very large and strange looking fuel tank. As I went by I saw the odd filler cap and a sticker that said LNG. This was an OTR truck with a full size sleeper, the company was Raven Transport out of Jacksonville FL. I've been seeing daycabs powered by natural gas for a few years now, but this is the first time I've noticed on OTR truck.
I have a few questions about this, just out of curiosity:
Is the infrastructure finally in place to support natural gas powered trucks running the road or is it limited to certain lanes?
What is the cost per mile of gas vs diesel? How many miles would a truck have to run to offset the (I'm assuming) higher price of the equipment?
What, if any, is the difference in LNG and CNG? Is one vs the other going to be the prominent form of natural gas fuel in big trucks and why?
Thanks in advance to anyone that has real-world experience with natural gas. I'm very curious about new technology and I find it fascinating that we may see a shift away from diesel (which has been the fuel of choice for the last 100 years) to something new within our lifetimes.
LNG powered OTR trucks
Discussion in 'Experienced Truckers' Advice' started by 8thnote, Jan 6, 2016.
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JRayl uses CNG and has local and long haul. Also hires new cdl grads.
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Can't answer all your questions but I do know that fueling CNG trucks can be a fairly inefficient process.
Most pumps are newly installed tech and have some issues. Occasionally freezing up or pumping extremely slowly taking hours to fill the tanks.8thnote Thanks this. -
No the infrastructure does not support LNG trucks yet that are operating in a true irregular route one way freight manner. This truck, although equipped with a sleeper, was running a pre determined dedicated route that enables the driver to refuel it at known locations.
8thnote Thanks this. -
My friend drives one of those trucks you saw. Yes, the infrastructure is loosely in place enough to support an OTR environment, assuming your definition of OTR is I-95:I-45. I say loosely in place because he has to be more particular about his route planning. He can go roughly 600 miles on a fill up, but it is recommended he not pass a fueling opportunity.
Those particular trucks have to idle to get heat. They have electric APU's but they don't produce heat. Initially, his company recommended he get a ceramic heater to stay warm. You can't put a Webasto heater on those trucks because Webastos use diesel. Same reason you cannot install a diesel-powered APU.
The primary difference between CNG and LNG is the length of time to fuel and size of the fuel tanks. LNG road trucks have 2 almost normal looking fuel tanks and he can fill up in about 8 minutes. CNG has a bank of tanks (looks like a sleeper box behind the cab). Inside that box is several small tanks. It takes a considerable amount of time to fill those up. You do not get anywhere near the range (miles) on CNG as you do LNG. ***Interesting Tidbit*** The Raven LNG trucks are delivered to Rush Peterbuilt in Jacksonville with CNG in the tanks. Rush preps the trucks (without idling), then the Rush mechanic drives to the LNG station in Jacksonville. That is less than 5 miles. There is a handful of red lights and 1 RRX they have to cross. If there is a train crossing the tracks, the Rush mechanic will run out of fuel and have to be towed the last 3/4 mi to the fueling station. Many times, the towing service spots a wrecker near that railroad crossing, just in case one of those trucks is headed to that fueling location. If you didn't catch it the first time, I will repeat it. Those LNG trucks are delivered with CNG in the tanks (NOT LNG). CNG helps season the tanks quicker, thus allowing more LNG in the tank (the colder the tanks, the more LNG fuel the tank will hold and the longer it last). LNG is the exact same thing as the natural gas a lot of people use to heat their homes or power their gas grills and stoves (that is Natural Gas, not Propane). The difference is, the Natural Gas in your home or your grill remains in a gaseous state. The Liquid Natural Gas in the LNG trucks has been chilled to change it from a gaseous state to a liquid state. When the LNG gets to the engine, it is compressed so the engine can use it to produce power (ie, is converted to CNG). That's why it's ok for those trucks to be delivered with CNG in the tanks instead of LNG.
At today cost per gallon of fuel, it will take a long time to recoup your investment in LNG trucks. The reason LNG/CNG is making a push is the cost of those 2 fuels is relatively stable over the long term. The cost of diesel fluctuates greatly over the long term. Right now, when I fuel my diesel tanks and my friend fills his LNG tanks, the cost per gallon (or in his case, diesel-to-gas equivalent) is very close to the same. The cost of diesel will begin to rise again and it wasn't too long ago diesel was at or very near $5.00/gallon. When the cost of diesel gets back to that rate, it won't take long to recoup your cost on LNG/CNG trucks.
Couple of things for an aside. 1) my friend recently had his first oil change (using special Natural Gas oil...it has additional additives regular diesel oil doesn't have and as a result, you can't get your service done just anywhere you want), at 50,000 miles. At that time, they also changes the spark plugs and wires. Yes, his LNG truck has spark plugs. Kind of hard to get use to thinking about a big truck having spark plugs. AND 2) he was told by one of the higher ups in his company, each of those LNG fuel tanks cost $15,000. Someone runs into the side of your truck and hits the LNG tank, it will not explode (those tanks are very safe) but someone will be spending $15K to replace that tank.
Lastly, as of now, most of the LNG fueling opportunities are located on Pilot Flying J property. Interesting choice of words? Yes and there is a reason for those words. PFJ does not own the LNG/CNG tanks. Clean Energy leases that property from PFJ to provide a fueling opportunity to their customers. My friend does not use a Comdata card to pay for his LNG at PFJ. He uses a Clean Energy card. What about PFJ loyalty points, showers, etc? Because the card is CE card, not comdata (and no opportunity to swipe his PFJ Rewards card), that kind of stuff is not automatically added to his Rewards card. He has to go to the PFJ cashier, show the cashier his CE fuel receipt and ask her to load points and showers on his Rewards card EVERYTIME. PFJ will load it because it is part of the Clean Energy lease agreement. There are at least 2 T/As that have LGN (Lafayette, LA and Baytown,TX). Those are Shell products, not Clean Energy and are located on the same fuel islands as regular diesel. He has to use his Comdata card and can swipe his T/A Loyalty card at the pump and get points, showers, etc.
Personally, listening to how my friend has to do everything with his LNG truck, it sounds like it is more trouble than what it is worth, at this point. Do I think that is where the industry is headed? Yes I do, but it will take time and will be very frustrating for those who get the industry to the point of LNG or CNG being as common and problem free as diesel.
I did not even touch on the lack of LNG/CNG certified mechanics and the delays has that caused my friend, but that is enough information for brain overload for now.kurbski, White_Knuckle_Newbie, ncdriver1 and 13 others Thank this. -
Great info! Sounds like a royal PIA! Pam Transport, Frito Lay, and a few others run LNG daycabs around Dallas.
88 Alpha Thanks this. -
88 Alpha Thanks this.
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You do understand, that is not first-hand information. It is at least 2nd-hand, as he relates his experiences to me and I relate it to you and others. I get what you are saying, tho.
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88 Alpha Thanks this.
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@8thnote, just talked to my friend. The truck you saw may very well have been him. He went through Chattanooga and on up I-75 sometime Monday headed to PA.
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