Canadian Companies Loading up in the USA

Discussion in 'Ask An Owner Operator' started by VNL780, May 1, 2010.

  1. johnday

    johnday Road Train Member

    Sorta what I thought as well, especially since he's got 11 years driving.:yes2557:
     
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  3. VNL780

    VNL780 Bobtail Member

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    May 1, 2010
    Toronto, Ontario
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    Okay to clear things up I have been driving for 11 years within Canada, haven't entered the US before so I had no idea about the rules.

    Secondly, as per one of the links posted, my practices are in accordance to United States Law. Point-to-point hauling is not allowed with the exception of incidental travel. It's not like I'm going in empty and running around in the States taking American driver's business. I am calling the FMCSA to confirm but it looks like I'm fine.

    I'm not trying to stir the pot or anything here, if it seems that way I apologize. Think about it this way, if US companies want to export into Canada it would be easier to have some Canadian truckers there to take your products and bring them here. US Customs has made this exception to make it possible for Canadian truckers to haul those loads without losing money. Yes, it does seem like I'm taking a load here and there from US drivers but if you want to export goods and boost your economy you can't expect Canadian truckers to go empty across 5 states on the way to the pick up.
     
  4. johnday

    johnday Road Train Member

    No, I don't think you're "stealing" U.S. jobs. I've got just short of 4 years driving, and have been a border jumper the whole time.

    Now, bringing a load into the U.S., then having to make multiple pickups to get back to Ca., is done all the time. It's no different than a U.S. driver taking a load to Montreal, then deadhead down to Oakville for a pickup, then to say, Missasauga for another pickup, then back to the U.S. to drop it, then rinse repeat.

    It seems the laws in the U.S. and Ca. parallel each other. I had run into something once I wasn't comfortable with though. I had picked up a load in Huntsville On. I think it was, and told to drop it in Milton, for another driver to bring it into the U.S.. Then I got an empty, and went elsewhere to get that load and bring it to N.Y. Just didn't seem right to me. The company, they have blue trucks, told me I was good to go. Ofcourse that was the weekend crew, and likely they didn't have a clue. I got away with it, but I don't feel it was right.


    I know I'll get some raised eyebrows over this, but oh well, it's just my opinion. I really don't see what the problem is with cross border trucking, we're all North Americans, like it not. I do have a rather biased opinion on how that could be taken care, maybe I should post it in the Joke section.

    I didn't go to the site yet that was offered to you, but that would likely help out a bit.:biggrin_255:
     
  5. Old Man

    Old Man Road Train Member

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    http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/intl-programs/intl-programs.htm

    Frequently asked Questions
    Q. A Canadian driver is taking a shipment from Canada for delivery to a point in the United States. The dispatcher has been notified of a shipment destined to Canada that is located in another state. May the driver take an empty trailer (deadhead) from the delivery point to the other state to pick up the shipment and deliver it to Canada?
    A. A driver may deadhead a trailer from one location to another within the United States PROVIDED the deadhead trailer is either the one the driver came in with or the one he or she is departing with. The driver may not haul an empty trailer from one location to drop it off at another location.
    Q. Under what circumstances may a driver enter with an empty tractor?
    A. 1) A driver may enter with an empty tractor to pick up a trailer for delivery to Canada or Mexico.
    A. 2) The driver may enter with an empty tractor to pick up a loaded trailer or goods previously brought from Canada or Mexico and left at the port-of-entry or a Customs warehouse or lot for government inspection or entry processing by a government agency, even if the driver did not bring the goods. (Note - this only applies when the goods have been held for Federal inspection by a government agency. It does not apply to goods that have already cleared inspection.)

    Q. Does the driver have to depart with the same trailer with which he or she entered the United States?
    A. The driver may drop a trailer at one location and drive empty to another location to pick up a loaded trailer destined to Canada or Mexico.

    Q. May a foreign driver taking a shipment from the United States to Canada also take merchandise destined to another point in the United States since it is on the way?
    A. No. For Immigration purposes, that is considered point-to-point hauling within the United States and is not permitted. The driver may only take goods loaded in the United States to Canada or Mexico.

    Q. May a driver perform associated functions such as loading and unloading cargo?
    A. The driver may perform a function that is a necessary incident to international trade. Loading and unloading that is merely incidental to the primary purpose of transporting goods into or out of the United States is permitted.

    Q. May a U. S. carrier employ foreign drivers?
    A. A United States carrier may employ a foreign driver if the driver is engaged only in the international delivery of goods and cargo to or from the United States. The foreign driver must have an established foreign residence that he or she does not intend to abandon. The foreign driver may not engage in any domestic carriage of goods without employment authorization to work in the U.S.

    Last Modified 02/28/2003
     
    johnday Thanks this.
  6. VNL780

    VNL780 Bobtail Member

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    May 1, 2010
    Toronto, Ontario
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    It was the site trucker101 posted.

    Thanks for the link, but just as I mentioned, as long as the pickup and drop off is on the way to get my pre-arranged load from let's just say Arkansas, then I am in the clear as per the CBP. It is the only exception allowing this type of movement. No Carrier or O/O in their right minds is going to travel empty from say Indiana to Arkansas just to get a load coming back. If you don't have people willing to haul back to Canada how can US business selling to Canada expect to get their shipment sent?
     
  7. johnday

    johnday Road Train Member

    Ya got people like us? LOL

    Talk about travelling across a number of states. How about a load coming from Menominee Mi, across the top to Levis PQ. Then deadhead all the way to Ottawa? One never knows what goes thru the minds of planners. LOL:biggrin_25526:
     
  8. Brickman

    Brickman Trucker Forum STAFF Staff Member

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    That does not stop them.

    I loaded at the same place in CO where a Canadian driver admitted he was picking up and delivering in the states before grabbing a load home. Didn't bother him in the slightest. "I never get caught."

    I don't think that DOT really enforces this law, other wise these guys wouldn't be so brave about doing it.


    After Katrina some of the northern Landstar lease drivers thought they would get in on the fat cow FEMA work. That worked out well for them right up until they got a call from Landstar telling them their lease was canceled on the spot.
     
  9. Brickman

    Brickman Trucker Forum STAFF Staff Member

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    Those maybe Canadian laws but not US laws.

    Nothing there about "incidental" hauling.
     
    walleye Thanks this.
  10. trucker_101

    trucker_101 Heavy Load Member

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    Maybe he was using this part of the rules?
    Cabotage Rules
    The U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS) describes what Canadian drivers can and cannot do while operating in the United States.
    Click here to download PDF

    __________________________________________________
    4. Use of Canadian-based Vehicles for Domestic Transportation. Generally, the use of
    Canadian-based vehicles for domestic movement of merchandise is prohibited. There is one exception. A domestic movement incidental to the immediate prior or subsequent engagement of a vehicle in international transportation is allowed. Incidental is defined as Ain the general direction of an export move or as part of the return movement to their
    base country@. It includes a movement en route to the pick-up of an export move. For example, a Toronto, ON-based carrier transports merchandise originating in Toronto and
    terminating in Miami, FL. The vehicle can then be used to pick up merchandise in Miami
    for delivery to St Louis, MO (a domestic move) where an export move will be picked up
    for delivery to Canada. The movement of merchandise from Miami to St Louis is
    considered incidental to the immediate prior or subsequent engagement of such vehicle in
    international transportation.
    The Canadian-based vehicle can also transport a domestic
    move in the general direction of an export move and then immediately return empty to
    Canada.

    The purpose of this change in cabotage regulations was to allow more efficient and economical
    utilization of vehicles both domestically and internationally.
    INS Requirements:
    1. Temporary Visitors for Business. Canadian truck drivers must meet the general entry
    requirements as a visitor for business. The requirements include:
    $ have a residence in a foreign country which he or she has no intention of
    abandoning,
    $ intend to depart the U.S. at the end of the authorized period of temporary
    admission,
    $ have adequate financial means to carry out the purpose of the visit to and
    departure from the U.S., and
    $ establish that he or she is not inadmissible to the U.S. under the provisions of
    section 212(
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2010
    jdrentzjr Thanks this.
  11. Brickman

    Brickman Trucker Forum STAFF Staff Member

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    trucker 101 I had never heard that before. A guy learns some thing new every day.
    lol
     
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